Goodbye Jol, hello Ramos

http://sport.independent.co.uk/football/premiership/article2881380.ece

http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/0,,2152906,00.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/sport/football.html?in_article_id=476682&in_page_id=1779&ct=5

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?view=DETAILS&grid=A1YourView&xml=/sport/2007/08/21/sfntot121.xml

I have to admit, reading those four articles has convinced me Jol will be gone before end of August.

I think he might be gone by Saturday!

If they've taken the decision and they really want Ramos, he'll want to come before the start of the Spanish season on Saturday.

Also, if the board waits and Jol gets 4 points from Utd away and Fulham away, he becomes unsackable (I'd presume) over the international break.

What a f*cking mess.

A mess indeed. If Jol goes, no matter who we get, it'll be the usual "transition" season. Forget CL, forget top 6 and forget any chance of winning a cup. Good and bad players will depart, undoubtedly we'll get some great players coming in to "sweeten" things with supporters. But net net, it will be more upheaval, more uncertainty, more instability. Equalling a big fat 10th spot in the league.

Levy and his merry band of half wits will seriously go down in my estimation if BMJ departs. In fact, they have already with the way they are handling this whole thing - through the media.

This whole affair stinks and yet another reason why I hate modern day football.

Darren Bent says - 'he aint going nowhere'

Does he count as an ITK?

From COYS man ITK:

all i will confirm right now is that ramos is 100% up for the job,he is not on good money at seville plus they are a selling club so he is happy to come,my understanding is ramos can wait a a few weeks to come it does not have to be done before la liga starts but that is not to say that the change may not happen this week cos it might but do not read to much into that as i have not had it confirmed yet (ie that mj is going before man u)

when i can say more about the whole episode i will

one thing i was holding back until after jol went has now been posted next door by ben so im now happy to confirm it that jol did speak to newcastle behind there backs and we found out and were extremely f55ked off with mj this was a year 18 months back during the souness/ roeder regimes at newcastle

i aint taking sides on this but as i said loyalty is a two way street and neither mj or our board are angels so it works both ways

So there you have it, Ramos in charge for the Man U game?

I fully expect BMJ to be in charge for the ManU game.

If so, Man Utd will be a crucial test. If the players are behind him they will give him 110% and fight hard to prove a point on his behalf. A win would make the board's argument that he can't do it against the top four look a bit silly.

However, if he can't get something from players commitment, endeavour, himself being tactically astute and with a couple of key Man Utd players out, then it strengthens Levy's argument.

Now it is on the BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/eng_prem/6954968.stm

Spurs chiefs 'lose faith in Jol'

Spurs boss Jol spent £40m on players during the summer
Tottenham boss Martin Jol's job remains under threat because he has lost the confidence of several top officials at the club, BBC Sport understands.
Sevilla coach Juande Ramos is in line to replace Jol, although the Spaniard's agent has denied links with Spurs.

BBC Radio 5live football correspondent Jonathan Legard says some officials are not sure Jol can deliver regular top-four Premier League finishes.

Spurs lost their first two matches this season but beat Derby 4-0 on Saturday.

On Monday, Ramos' agent Alvaro Torres denied there had been any talks with Tottenham, despite Spanish press reports claiming that the 52-year-old coach met with Spurs officials at the weekend.

Both clubs said Ramos' appearance at a Spanish hotel was a private matter and Torres said the meeting was with a friend and had "nothing to do with football".

Jol came under pressure after the two losses - to Sunderland and Everton - in the first four days of the season following a £40m summer outlay on players.

One bookmaker suspended betting on Jol's departure on Friday but Spurs have insisted they are not negotiating for a new manager.

Some fans also believe it is too soon to make a decision on Jol's future after only three Premier League matches.

Daniel Wynne of the Tottenham Hotspur Supporters' Trust confirmed: "It's far too early to see how the season will go.

"Jol has taken us to fifth twice, which is better than any other manager, and has been backed in the summer with his signings."

Ramos has a contract with Sevilla until 2008 and was linked with the vacant post at Manchester City before Sven-Goran Eriksson was appointed at Eastlands.

it's madness. THFC PLC have lost the plot. The beeb is normally shit hot with these stories so it must be true. May be our last game with BMJ on Sunday. Shame it's away as if it was at WHL then I'm sure there would be a MARTIN JOLS BLUE AND WHITE ARMY for 90 minutes.

Same old shite. THFC PLC are morons.

Yep - all looking a bit depressing now

Yep - all looking a bit depressing now

why don't you say it one more time for good measure twiglet...

I've just exchanged emails with Jim at Topspurs. His "snout" confirms that Jol will be told to sling his hook as soon as the replacement can be confirmed. No mention who this might be.

All too depressing for words This season is already doomed to the zhit heap and I suspect the next one too. Sunday at OT will be a nightmare.

FECK IT!!!!

Yep -


No I cant do it - Fucking wankers that they are - How on earth can this be happening - in the words of that cockney granny on Catherine Tate - its a fucking liberty

I remember the feeling of not wanting Daveeeeeed Ginola to go some years ago. It stinks.

ezza wrote:

I've just exchanged emails with Jim at Topspurs. His "snout" confirms that Jol will be told to sling his hook as soon as the replacement can be confirmed. No mention who this might be.

All too depressing for words This season is already doomed to the zhit heap and I suspect the next one too. Sunday at OT will be a nightmare.

FECK IT!!!!

Disagree. I'd personally reserve judgement on Jol until the end of the season. However, I do kind of see where Levy is coming from and it would be hypocritical for me to argue otherwise.

I felt Jol was unlucky to loss Carrick. However, I just don't think he is a top manager.

Levy is taking a bold step - some may say foolish, others would say decisive. A new manager will have some top players to work alongside. There are better managers than Jol and deep down I think we all know it. I said at the start of the season Spurs would finish 6th. That isn't good enough. A better manager who can maximise what is at his disposal could clinch 4th spot.

I'm in the minority but I back Levy. Its a business - no room for sentiment. If someone else is better and available, bye bye. That's life. Football is no different. If Spurs finish 4th and Holland approached Jol what would he do ????

A new manager (even a reputable and well known one) may not necessarily bring us to the 4th place we all hope for. On the contrary, he may bring disruption to the team. Bale, Boateng, Bent etc may be wondering whether they will be picked by the new man.

Look at Jacques Santini - a world cup winner with France and see what he did to us! Even if the board is appointing Capello, I still don't want to see Jol go at this point of the season when he isn't afforded to play his best players like King, Dawson, Lennon, Bale etc yet.

I agree Jezza, there are far better managers out there than BMJ. What I don't agree with is replacing a manager so soon into a new season. If the Board were truely unhappy with BMJ then he should have packed his bags a month ago. Allowed a new coach time to settle in and work with the players in preseason. Now all we'll end up with this season is transition as uncertainty creeps in and players come and go. Without BMJ 10th spot and no Europe is looming large. With BMJ and a fully fit squad we've got a good chance of 4th and definitely another uefa cup spot, worst case.

And I'm also unhappy at the underhanded, unprofessional way the board is conducting matters - in full view of their current employee and through the media. Its a disgrace and something that is unacceptable in any line of business. No one would want to be at the receiving end of this stinky affair. Not least a person who's passionate about the club and relatively speaking has a good track record. Levy and Comoli have a considerable amount to answer for as this reflects very poorly on this once very great club. Another sad chapter in our modern history.

Ezza - I did say I personally would wait until end of season.

I think 5th spot last season gave us a false sense of security. Forget about cup runs for a moment - you must be judged on your league finish.

With all the injuries Arsenal had last season, it was a perfect opportunity to grab a CL spot. We did finish okay but we spent most of the season chasing a UEFA cup spot, which at one stage was looking doubtful. It was in my opinion a needless step back. Jol said himself he felt our squad was stronger than previous season despite losing Carrick.

Football can be harsh cos there is a very fine line between success and failure. For me, the great managers are those that manage to influence the game by making a tactical change.....doing something bold, out of the ordinary. Jose did it against us - taking a left back off after 20 odd minutes and switching to just 3 at the back.

I've never felt Spurs are capable of clinching 4th spot this season. I said that prior to the KO. Sunderland/Everton reinforced my opinion. This season there are stronger clubs than Spurs. Newcastle, Man City and Pompey are very capable of finishing above us.

If pressure from fans bring about a change of opinion from the board I guarantee Spurs will finish outside top four. Jol is NOT taking us to 4th. Just don't see it. In which case the season under Jol is already a write off. ( oh hang, Spurs fans are suppose to be content with 5th spot ). Well I'm not and if Levy has idenified someone who he think can compete with the likes of Wenger/Fergie/Jose etc, and turn us into 4th spot contender THIS season he has my backing. Sure, we'll have some good nights with Jol in charge, but no way are we going to finish 4th. Arsenal had there transition season 05'06.

I would have replaced Jol in the summer, but it was difficult. Had Spurs finished in 7th-8th spot, where we had been for most of the season, he would have gone.

It had been handled poorly but I'll also reserve judgment on Levy until May. He is no fool. He might yet land us a top four spot.

I have to say though - virtually every Spurs fan I speak to is pro Jol. If he is sacked the Board are in for one hell of a rocky time from the fans.

I agree with Ezza on the handling of the situation. I have however always let it be known I rate Levy higher than Jol so I feel compelled to back him.

What a shame it's come to this - very messy.

Bookies Sack Jol And Make Ramos Odds On Favourite To Succeed Him
Ramos 2/5 favourite to succeed Jol:
BOOKIES SACK JOL - AND START BETTING ON WHO'LL BE NEXT TO GO.......With the uncertainty about Martin Jol's position causing confusion over his immediate future, bookmakers William Hill have removed him from their betting for who will be the first Premiership manager of the season to leave his club - and started betting without him. 'The only people looking to back Martin Jol to be the first boss to go are those who believe they know rather more than we do - and as they almost certainly do, we are not inclined to hand them an early Christmas present by continuing to quote them odds. So we have taken the decision ourselves to sack Martin Jol from our list and bet without him - making Sammy Lee 7/4 favourite to be the next Premiership manager for the chop' said Hill's spokesman Graham Sharpe.
Hills have taken bets for Jol to be the first to go at odds of up to 9/1, at which price one customer has staked £300, and will obviously honour all such bets should he prove to be the winner of that market. 'We will face a modest, five figure payout should Jol be the first boss out, and don't believe that punters with inside information have been taking advantage of the odds on offer. But if we carried on betting we would most certainly be at the mercy of those with access to sources close to the club - and would deserve all the financial punishment we would undoubtedly receive'.
William Hill - First Premiership manager to go - betting without Martin Jol - 7/4 Sammy Lee; 7/1 Chris Hutchings; Gareth Southgate; 8/1 Harry Redknapp; 9/1 Steve Bruce; 14 Curbishley; 16 Davies; Sanchez; 25 Allardyce; Keane; Moyes; O'Neill; 33 Benitez; Hughes; Mourinho; Wenger;
40 Coppell; Eriksson; No Manager To Go During Season; 50 Ferguson.
**JUANDE RAMOS has been installed as 2/5 favourite to become the next permanent Spurs manager with William Hill, who make Marcello Lippi 4/1 second favourite, with Jurgen Klinsmann at 5/1 and Harry Redknapp 8/1.

8/1? Should be evens...

Sorry Jezza but (in my book) thats all toffeecock.

spur'don wrote:

I'd personally reserve judgement on Jol until the end of the season.

Be nice if we had the chance to reserve judgment - the way it looks we're not going to be able to

spur'don wrote:

However, I do kind of see where Levy is coming from and it would be hypocritical for me to argue otherwise.

Er, in an earlier thread you said the exact opposite. What is your argument? This one or the one you said earlier?

spur'don wrote:

Levy is taking a bold step - some may say foolish, others would say decisive. A new manager will have some top players to work alongside. There are better managers than Jol and deep down I think we all know it.

Yes, maybe there are better managers and maybe we do know it but, is there any other manager available at this stage that will do better for us this season. I doubt it.

spur'don wrote:

I said at the start of the season Spurs would finish 6th.

Does that mean we will (would have)?

spur'don wrote:

That isn't good enough. .

For who?

And will replacing Jol now increase our chances of a 'higher than 6th' finish (this season)?

spur'don wrote:

A better manager who can maximise what is at his disposal could clinch 4th spot.

Well yes maybe so but once again, is that gonna be possible at this stage?

spur'don wrote:

Its a business - no room for sentiment.

I happen to think there's plenty of room for sentiment - yes its run as a buisiness but at the moment its being run like a bloody bad business.

spur'don wrote:

If someone else is better and available, bye bye.

Er, who is both better and available right now?

spur'don wrote:

If Spurs finish 4th and Holland approached Jol what would he do ????

Well who knows but maybe he might just show some of that old fashioned sentiment and stick by those that have stuck by him

twiglet wrote:

Yep -


No I cant do it - Fucking wankers that they are - How on earth can this be happening - in the words of that cockney granny on Catherine Tate - its a fucking liberty

What a fucking mess. Once again we snatch failure from the jaws of success, or something like that. BMJ deserved(s) to stay till the end of the season. If he had failed, I am sure he would have had the dignity to resign. For me, BMJ is an honourable man surrounded by a pack of unscrupulous nasty pieces of work. If, god forbid that twitchy, corrupt bastard Redknapp takes over, I'll give up. Maybe, just maybe, Ramos can take us to the next level if he comes, but life at WHL without BMJ will never be the same. Same old Tottenham, always fucking up......... BIG TIME